From: David Morey (us@divadeus.freeserve.co.uk)
Date: Wed Jul 28 2004 - 21:44:11 BST
Simply: is cosmological mathematics intellectual?
What has that to do with the social level?
Go away and think again.
regards
David M
----- Original Message -----
From: "johnny moral" <johnnymoral@hotmail.com>
To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2004 8:48 PM
Subject: RE: MD the metaphysics of free-enterprise
> This looks like people are getting caught in the confusion between the
> consciousness/mind/intellect and the intellectual level.
>
> All patterns of every level exist as ideas or consciousness, they are what
> create consciousness and ideas, and are in turn carried forward by the
> consciousness. But though every pattern is an idea, not all ideas are
> fourth level ideas. Only those that describe the interaction of third
level
> patterns are fourth level ("inter-social" would be a better name for the
> fourth level - we call people that notice how social patterns interact
> "intellectuals", but they are not the only people who use their
intellect).
> So, in Paul's question below, yes, an individual biological organism
> experiences the world, and society is defined by the relationships between
> different individual people, and all of these are experienced within
> consciousnesses, indivually, as ideas. But that doesn't make them 4th
> level, intellectual patterns, since they don't describe the expected
> interactions of social patterns.
>
>
> >From: "Paul Turner" <paul@turnerbc.co.uk>
> >Reply-To: moq_discuss@moq.org
> >To: <moq_discuss@moq.org>
> >Subject: RE: MD the metaphysics of free-enterprise
> >Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2004 09:54:50 +0100
> >
> >Hi David
> >
> >David said:
> >The world-individual dualism appears on 4th level together and
> >inseperably.
> >
> >Paul:
> >And exclusively? Does an individual biological organism not experience
> >the world? Is a society not defined by the relationships between
> >different individual people?
> >
> >David said:
> >In the context of this duality the gap/clearing emerges into which
> >pours/becomes intellectual creations moving from DQ to SQ.
> >
> >Paul:
> >Can this "gap/clearing" be readily experienced? What does it feel like?
> >
> >David said:
> >The intellectual patterns are characterised in the space between
> >language/individual/world.
> >Make any sense.
> >
> >Paul:
> >Not really. Heidegger?
> >
> >Cheers
> >
> >Paul
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
> >Mail Archives:
> >Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
> >Nov '02 Onward -
http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
> >MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
> >
> >To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
> >http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
> >
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfeeŽ
> Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
>
>
> MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
> Mail Archives:
> Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
> Nov '02 Onward -
http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
> MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
>
> To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
> http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
>
MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archives:
Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Thu Jul 29 2004 - 14:09:51 BST