From: Erin N. (enoonan@kent.edu)
Date: Sun Jan 05 2003 - 02:19:03 GMT
Mari,
I first just want to point out that I am not
speaking for Pirsig. I don't know why he does what
he does..just speculations.
>Hi Erin,
>> Thanks for your feedback. i'd like to ask a few questions.
>
>Can you explain "karmic garbage"?
>"Concerns" can be a good thing.
>Are you saying that there is a connection between "programs" and "plans" and
>"karmic garbage"? Can MoQ.org be viewed as a "program" of sorts?
>http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=program
I am going to come back to this one in another post.
I tried to write out my ideas about it when
John and Wim were discussing something.
So I will explain this more later and just want
to say again they are just my personal speculations.
> "Everybody's ideas of a
>> good program is going to be different, depending
>> on what you value."
>And that means what? don't use something that obviously has Value and the
>potentiality to make a difference in the world? Don't rally the wagons and
>move "it" to another level where it effects changes in a collectively agreed
>upon way???
It obviously has value. To who--people who value it.
Glenn has participated for how long...ask him
if it has obviously has value. Glenn is very intelligent too.
I think everybody can experience quality but
am wondering if you need to be dominated by
intellectual level to understand it.
Maybe, maybe not.
>>"MOQ works very well for me as a personal tool to
>> understand how different people value different
>> things and its all good." Nothing wrong with that Erin. Let your
>conscience and values be your guide. That said, it doesn't mean there is no
>Value in joining forces and making a difference beyond ones personal space.
I am participating here. I also do other things that
I don't care to list out. This 'moq cause' is not
clear to me. I don't understand what you want.
>>"> If Pirsig values freedom wouldn't it be contradictory
>> to develop a program to tell people what to do."
>Connecting the dots in this way, lends itself IMHO to convoluting the
>picture: "If Pirsig values freedom wouldn't it be contradictory to develop a
>program 'to tell people what to do'" to tell people what to do"? Where did
>that come from? What about "being united" in conviction, aim, and intent?
>"Give me a place to stand on, and I will move the earth."
>Sometimes i think that responses to posts here in MoQdg sound like the
>bickering by democrates at republicans and visa versa forgetting all the
>while that first they are human, then countrymen and then politicans.
I read in a previous post ( i don't think it was
by you) that we don't have enough antagonists to
Pirsig's work. Now I have to read why can't we all agree in
your post.I am sorry but it seems this list is damned
if we do agree and damned if we don't. Again what you want is not clear to me.
i'm even awed at his insights! But
>unlike other brillant minds that contribute to the knowedge base and then
>follow through with personal partisipation Mr Pirsig dropped out and i don't
>buy his explaination of why he leaves us alone. When Arthur Rimbaud did a
>similar thing it was said that he commited artistic suicide. Didn't WJ Sidis
>do the same thing; drop out?
>i have been blessed to meet and talk with some of the people who i admire
>and effected positive change in my life. i wish RMP was one of them!
>
Maybe everybody is not the same Mari.
Maybe some people are meant to teaching and others in writing novels.
I was struck by the image in a classroom where
he sat silently freaking the students out.
I read somewhere but can't remember the name
of a buddhist term about somebody who refuses
to teach. Not that teaching has no value but
maybe its not for everyone. I don't agree with you with the hiding out
part. My intuitions say its for his own
moral reasons. Again I think it is wrong to tell a novelist
he is not doing anything.
Imagine after you put all the work into your
play somebody coming up to you and
asking so why have you been hiding out and
not doing anything.
Would you have felt the same need to
get after Picasso of not having a program to
unite the world?
I think storytelling changes the world not
plans or programs so yes I do think Pirsig
is doing something and not hiding out.
James Joyce--"silence, cunning, exile"
Erin
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