From: khaled Alkotob (khaledsa@juno.com)
Date: Fri Aug 12 2005 - 16:16:36 BST
On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 12:50:52 +0200 skutvik@online.no writes:
> OK, back to the issue at hand ... without stepping on toes ;-) You
> will have noticed that the MOQ places religion(s) at the social
> level and when a person identifies with religion she/he is social
> value focussed. There is nothing derogatory about that, we are all
> of all value levels. As I see it the only handicap is to be static
> fixated without any notion of the dynamic aspect of existence.
khaled:
The way I see it, religion is the lowest common denominator ( basic
algebra) that the masses can absorb while MOQ tend to be the graduate
course level ( Calculus) the few of us will go exploring.
> If you see Islam as an off-shoot of the existing monotheism of the
> region, or if this is anathema? From your introduction about the
> common prophets it looks like the relationship is acknowledged.
> At least Arabia was farther away from the Mediterranean shore
> and when Mohammed had his revelation it was not influenced by
> the budding intellect that had been brewing in Greece for a
> millennium by then.
1. Look at map and see where Mecca is, Not that far form the holy land.
2. Mohammed's brother in law was a christian priest. ( his first wife's
brother)
3. Jews and Christian were in the neighborhood. Islam did not come in a
vacuum
4. Mecca was already a pilgrimage destination, for what religion (s) I
don't know
5. The old testament and the Koran agree on 99% of the story. ( the
exception being Abraham's sacrifice)
>
> The Jewish culture-religion was so influenced and Jesus was a
> sensitive antenna for that, he claimed that the "Law" was no
> longer absolute. The individual and its worth had become central
> and hence Christianity. Judaism itself resisted the pressure and
> much of these roots trailed after Christianity. And the various
> Church Consiles added a lot of obscure dogmatic points that are
> rather difficult, no wonder that those who crave simplicity looks to
> Islam.
Yes Islam came and illuminated all the go-in-between. The church, the
priests, the icons.
It had a Buddhist feel to it in the scene that it was you and God. Short
of you becoming the Buddha. You could hold your prayer anywhere and talk
to God directly in your Name.
> End of history lesson ;-) I read your story Khaled, it ended with
> you stating that democracy is just the icing on an economical
> cake, but the MOQ says that democracy is an intellectual pattern
> and among other intellectual ones the very foundation for .... for
> "progress". It's too much to expect that any Muslim is able to give
> an correct account of the present - you know - "conflict", but one
> can not help asking, particularly what the Militant Muslims hopes
> or wants to achieve with terror? Not the individual youth who
> straps on the exolosives, but Osama Bin Laden and his
> lieutenants. That's the enigma.
>
> Your thoughts?> Bo
>
What I am saying is that when your run for cover from a deluge, what is
protecting you from the rain is irrelevant. Yes democracy is an
intellectual pattern but you have to stop and think about it. When I was
in college working to finish my degree, a retirement plan was the last
thing on my mind. Yes a retirement plan and a medical plan are a great
thing to have, but at that time it was surviving the moment. When you are
hunkering down in a bomb shelter, you don't care who will be running the
government next. You just want the shelling to stop.
As long as the Sultan was wise, and he held courts for his citizens and
shared the wealth, people didn't care what other forms of government
were out there. As for freedom of speech, life would be so good, there
would be nothing to bitch about. ( OK i am oversimplifying it here )
Pirsing takes a trip across the country in order for all these ideas to
gel in his head.
Khaled
MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archives:
Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Fri Aug 12 2005 - 16:51:52 BST