From: Steve Peterson (peterson.steve@verizon.net)
Date: Wed May 14 2003 - 17:55:57 BST
Hi Paul, Phyllis,
>> PIRSIG: 'He simply meant that at the cutting edge of
>> time, before an object can be distinguished, there
>> must be a kind of non-intellectual awareness, which he
>> had called awareness of Quality.
>
Steve:
The issue you are discussing reminds me of Wilber's pre/trans fallacy. It
is easy to confuse what is pre-rational (e.g. mythology) and what is
trans-rational (intuition?), since both are non-rational. (It also applies
to pre-egoic stages of development (new born) to the trans-egoic (Buddha).)
I think what Pirsig is getting at throughout ZAMM as Phaedrus pursues the
"ghost of reason" is trans-rationality.
The Poincare story is a good example. His insight that leads to a new
mathematical understanding is transrational. Though Pirsig talks about
pre-intellectual awareness, he is talking about a higher awareness preceding
a lower one -- preceeding all lower ones including emotions (biological
patterns) and inorganic awareness. What the mathematician perceives is more
like an aesthetic awareness (trans-rational) that is later intellectualized
into formulas and theorems not a rationalization of an emotional
(pre-rational) response.
Phyllis:
> The inorganic again: works for the hot stove example, but how do youexplain
> seeing a painting at this level?
> Actually, lots right, but that inorganic puzzle piece seems a bad fit, but
> then again, I'm not a physicist.
Steve:
Phyllis, I don't have a problem with inorganic awareness. I would define
inorganic patterns of value as the values that hold materials together.
For me, inorganic patterns that I am aware of include color, shape, size,
texture, etc. Inorganic patterns themselves are not aware of these
inorganic patterns. Only a higher level pattern could experience inorganic
quality in these secondary kinds of ways (as patterns of value). Instead
atoms experience inorganic value directly as the preference to bond with
particular types of atoms and rocks experience the preference to fall down
rather than up.
What do you think?
Thanks,
Steve
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