From: David Buchanan (DBuchanan@ClassicalRadio.org)
Date: Mon Sep 06 2004 - 00:28:43 BST
Ilya Korobkov asked:
How does it happen that in our ordinary life we don't feel ourselves as
three separate entities - biological, social and intellectual, but feel
ourselves as one whole self? If you say that the self is illusion, then I
will ask, THE ILLUSION OF WHOM? ...WHERE or IN WHOM does this hierarchy
exist? If there
are no place and no one where or in whom the hierarchy exist then the very
idea of hierarchy doesn't make any sense! We are exactly where we had
started from.
dmb butts in:
The illusory nature of the self gets at the difference between Dynamic
reality, the mystical reality, the reality of the Buddhas and ordinary,
static, conventional reality. Any discussion of the real Self takes us
beyond the ability of our language and concepts and is always bound to
produce paradoxical or seemingly contradictory statements. I'd like to focus
on the first question, which can largely be answered by developmental
psychology, but let me just say that there are good answers to the more
difficult question too. Its a question better answered by mystics and Zen
masters than by any kind of conventional intellectual, so I'd recommend that
approach.
So why don't we feel ourselves as divided? First of all, I'd argue that we
actually do experience the various levels all the time. I get hungry and
sleepy every day and feel my biological self quite accutely every time I
bump my head. I feel my social self when I show up for work on time, cash my
check or drop my son off at school and I feel my intellectual self whenever
I come here, open a decent book or magazine or otherwise enter the world of
ideas. And who is it that is watching all that? This is where the great
mystery comes into it. There are many names for this Witness but, again,
this is the realm of mysticism, not developmental psychology. To get at this
multi-layered self, Ken Wilber might be helpful...
"...at each stage or level of development, the self is faced with certain
tasks. How it negotiates those tasks determines whether it winds up
relatively healthy or realtively disturbed. First and foremost, at each
stage of development, the self starts out identified with that stage, and it
must accomplish the tasks appropriate to that stage, whether learning toilet
training or learning language. But in order for development to continue, the
self has to let go of that stage, or disindentify with it, in order to make
room for the new and higher stage. In other words, it has to DIFFERENTIATE
from the lower stage, identify with the higher stage, and then integrate the
higher with the lower."
Notice how the process of development is basically described as a series of
identities. Each stage brings a different world view and an expanded level
of awareness moving from one's body, to larger and larger parts of society
such as family, tribe, nation, and on to the intellectual self that can take
all that in along with the worldviews from other times and cultures - and
then even beyond intellectual levels too. In each case, assuming that growth
is normal and healthy, the lower stages are included in the newer, higher
identity. We don't, for example, forget how to use the toilet or the
language when we move into the intellectual realm. Its just that we longer
indentify our self with those things anylonger and in fact hardly can recall
that we ever did. Its funny. Children who watch themselves preforming (on
videotape) at lower levels are embarrassed and will often deny that it is
really them on the tape. Many say they do not recall or try to invent
excuses for the lower level behavior.
Does that help?
dmb
MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org
Mail Archives:
Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/
Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html
MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net
To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at:
http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.5 : Mon Sep 06 2004 - 00:35:10 BST