From: Platt Holden (pholden@sc.rr.com)
Date: Fri Jul 29 2005 - 21:19:19 BST
Hi Arlo,
> [Arlo]
> Except the brujo was not one, single "solitary" soul. If he was, he would
> have been nothing more than a set of high Quality biological patterns.
He was the sole individual "responsible" for saving his tribe. Without
him, the social layer from which he emerged would not have evolved and
instead gone the way of the dinosaurs.
> Don't continue to misunderstand, individuals emerge through the social
> layer (not separate from it). They are able to respond to intellectual
> quality because of the social layer. Their responses to intellectual
> quality are shaped by the social layer. And, their actions in pursuit of
> intellectual quality are completely supported by a social layer providing
> artifacts, libraries, colleagues, assistants, etc, without which your
> "individual" could do nothing (except enjoy biological Quality).
All true, but not evolutionary.
> But, that individuals, re-mediating their experience back into the social
> layer, from which they emerge, drives the evolution of social and
> intellectual Quality, is not in doubt.
Yes. Without the individual no response to DQ, no evolution.
> [Platt]
> Of course there's no denying your point about society being necessary to
> support the individual and to react to individual DQ responses. But to
> claim "me" is a delusion? Doesn't it say Arlo Bensinger on your birth
> certificate? :-)
>
> [Arlo]
> I didn't make this claim, I am only restating it. Einstein made the claim.
> And I happen to agree with it. "Arlo Bensinger" is a semiotic marker. If
> "I" were born onto a desert island, "Arlo Bensinger" would not exist.
Are you saying that names create existence? That form of Idealism is a new
one on me. If your desert island mother had named you Zog, would you
exist? Or if she had died giving birth leaving you alone without a name,
would you not exist, even if for a short time (hopefully to be adopted by
apes or wolves)?
Any good book on semantics will tell you that the word is not the thing,
that symbols are independent of the things symbolized, the map is not the
territory, the menu is not the food. Or, as the bard wrote, "That which we
call a rose by any other word would smell as sweet." I presume that the
four moral levels that comprise you would be as sweet even if your name
was George. :-)
Platt
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