From: MATTHEW PAUL KUNDERT (mpkundert@students.wisc.edu)
Date: Wed Nov 19 2003 - 02:33:25 GMT
Platt,
Platt said:
The MOQ adds "value" to the physical senses Matt lists. Value is our sixth sense.
Matt said:
As I read Pirsig, Quality is a redescription of reality into value, not an addition of value. The physical senses are still the only senses we have, they are just "inorganic static patterns of value" senses.
Pirsig said:
"In the third box are the biological patterns: senses of touch, sight hearing, smell and taste. The Metaphysics of Quality follows the empirical tradition here in saying that the senses are the starting point of reality, but -- all importantly -- it includes a sense of value. Values are phenomena. To ignore them is to misread the world."
Platt said:
Could anything be clearer?
Matt:
You're a fan of logic, right Platt. So riddle me this: if Quality is Reality, i.e. if value is EVERYTHING, how can we have an _extra_ sense for value, if all of our senses are already senses for value?
Ambiguity in the word, perhaps? Yah, I think so. In the SODV paper, unlike in ZMM and Lila, I bet Pirsig is using "value" in the regular ole' dictionary definition way, which means its limited to, say, "social values" or "dictionary definition morality".
So, what was clear again?
I'll tell you: 1) it wasn't clear to me what you meant, so I guessed and 2) you aren't very good at clarifying because you simply added what your were referring to without any attention to what I said.
Sorry, <sniff>. I had a bad day.
Matt
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