From: Mark Steven Heyman (markheyman@infoproconsulting.com)
Date: Tue Aug 17 2004 - 05:44:39 BST
Hi Ian, and all,
msh said:
People use logical argument all the time in
their attempts to persuade, or to justify their actions. Bush and
Major [sic] and company offered at least 4 different arguments for
the invasion of Iraq, one after the other as each preceding argument
was proved fallacious. I think, using logical and evidentiary
analysis, the persuasiveness of an argument can be reduced to
near 0. Which in some circumstance might save lives.
Ian replied ...
I don't understand Mark, unless you're being ironic.
Of course people continue to use logic to justify their actions,
both for and against war in your example, and yes (in theory) they
can reduce the argument to 0 (or equally 100%).
But look where it gets us - bad deciscions.
Logic is a triumph of wishful-thinking over reality.
Which brings me back to the political correctness thread.
msh says:
Well, I guess I'm being ironic in the sense that I'm assuming that
the commercial media will provide equal coverage to all sides of an
argument, and that policy-makers in a putative democracy will be
influenced by the opinion of the majority. Since this in no way
resembles the world in which we live, yes, irony reigns supreme.
However, for fun, let's assume my two preposterous premises. In the
case
of the most recent attack on Iraq, here's what would have happened
(Ian,
substitute the British equivalents):
1) People like Scott Ritter, Dennis Halliday, Hans von Sponeck,
Michael Parenti, Howard Zinn, Noam Chomsky, Robert Fisk, Robert
Parry, Alexander Cockburn would have received as much air and print
exposure as people like Rush Limbaugh, Bill O'Reilly, Hannity and
Whats-his name, Dan Rather, Ted Koppel, Peter Jennings, Jim Leher,
Gordon Liddy, Oliver North, Colin Powell, Donald Rumsfeld, Connie
Rice, Cheney and Bush.
2) Had this happened, the people of the US and Britain would have
had more than enough information to recognize the bullshit evidence
and bad logic advanced by their leaders for the purpose of justifying
a
murderous attack on a harmless and defenseless nation as the only way
of
removing a vicious tyrant who, only a few years before, still vicious
and
tyrannical, had been the darling of the same Western Powers who now
sought
his destruction.
3) Armed with this information, the people of the US and GB, (again,
in
my hypothetical world where governments are not owned by business and
therefore respond to the will of the of the people) might very well
have
prevented the slaughter of thousands upon thousands of human beings
who
were no threat to anyone and had less to do with the 9-11 attacks
than any
tax-paying American (or Briton) who cheered or, worse, remained
silent.
Ian, this is how logic and evidentiary analysis might, and sometimes
does, save lives.
O Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood...
Best,
Mark (msh)
--
InfoPro Consulting - The Professional Information Processors
Custom Software Solutions for Windows, PDAs, and the Web Since 1983
Web Site: http://www.infoproconsulting.com
"Thought is only a flash between two long nights, but this flash is
everything." -- Henri Poincare'
--
InfoPro Consulting - The Professional Information Processors
Custom Software Solutions for Windows, PDAs, and the Web Since 1983
Web Site: http://www.infoproconsulting.com
"Thought is only a flash between two long nights, but this flash is
everything." -- Henri Poincare'
Mark Steven Heyman (msh)
-- InfoPro Consulting - The Professional Information Processors Custom Software Solutions for Windows, PDAs, and the Web Since 1983 Web Site: http://www.infoproconsulting.com "Thought is only a flash between two long nights, but this flash is everything." -- Henri Poincare' MOQ.ORG - http://www.moq.org Mail Archives: Aug '98 - Oct '02 - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/ Nov '02 Onward - http://www.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/summary.html MD Queries - horse@darkstar.uk.net To unsubscribe from moq_discuss follow the instructions at: http://www.moq.org/md/subscribe.html
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