Re: MD Pirsig an artist - MoQ & love

From: Valence (valence10@hotmail.com)
Date: Sat Jan 25 2003 - 01:51:19 GMT

  • Next message: David Buchanan: "RE: MD Question"

    Hey Willy and all,
    This looks like fun thread. Thought I'd offer my thoughts.

    WILLY WROTE
    My question is... how love fits in the MoQ and what role it plays there.

    Some theses:
    - love equals quality *first dynamic, then static*
    - love is imagination, is not a value (or is this too subject-object
    orientated?)
    - love is like a person's free will; you believe in it but it doesn't
    exist. You call it love and you find reasons for it but actually it's
    just hormones and a simplistic pattern of biological value and I am
    really overreacting on this.

    Who else has theses?

    RICK
        I do. My thesis is this: Love is a species of value.

    PIRSIG
    In the [MoQ] "causation" is a metaphysical term that can be replaced by
    "value." To say that "A *causes* B" or to say that "B *values* precondition
    A" is to say the same thing [LILA ch 8 p119].

    RICK
        So what would be the difference between saying "B *values* precondition
    A" and "B *loves* precondition A"? To me it sounds though the difference is
    one of intensity. Maybe "love" is the label applied to the relationships
    with the patterns we value most intensely.
        We hear people speak of love for life and health, friends and family,
    art and music... Some people love their jobs, some people love philosophy.
    We love our mates in dozens of ways. There are so many things we speak of
    loving, but I think that in almost all the meanings of the word "love" the
    bottom line, in MoQ terms, is revealed to be the intensity of the value
    being fulfilled (this would also explain the often noted relationship of
    "love" and the equally intensive "hate").
        By this explanation of Love, we really can see Love at work in all
    levels of the MoQ. Since all patterns at all levels value things, they can
    love as well.

    just a thought
    rick

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